Marty: Hey everyone. Welcome again to the True You Podcast, where we look at this journey of being human and focusing on who we really are so that we can be our best, our most comfortable face, our challenges, and be fulfilled. So I am always joined by my dear partner in this crime, bill Tierney, right, who's an IFS practitioner and a results oriented coach. I myself am a leadership coach with a new book out called Leadership as Relation, and we're joined today Violet Eden. So.

Bill: Welcome.

Violet: Hi. nice to be here.

Marty: It's good to have you.

Bill: Let me just talk a minute. Let me just say something about how, how I met Violet and, and it came to introduce her, and then I'd love to have you, uh, read her bio and, and let's, then, let's get into it. How's that sound?

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Bill: Okay, so, and, and just before we hit record, I was trying to remember how did this happen? A, a, a week or two ago, violet and I had a conversation on Zoom and I was absolutely enthralled. We'd already agreed that she would be on the podcast and I was even more excited once we had a conversation and I'm eager to get, get into some of the things that we, we have already talked about and maybe some things that we haven't yet. Um, so Parts Work Practice is a free. Uh, practice group for folks that wanna practice the IFS model. And we, my, my partner Alison Dyer, who was a guest earlier on the TrueView podcast, and I have been running that group now for about four and a half years. And part of that group is a private Facebook group called Parts Work Practice, which is, which by Violet is a, um, a participant in. And she posted a comment or a question. Uh, um, in, in one of the IFS groups and I responded to it and that's how we connected. And then I special messaged, I messaged, messaged her on Messenger and asked would she be interested in, in being on the podcast. And so here she is.

Violet: Yes.

Bill: I.

Marty: And, before we really get to hear your voice, let us sort of contextualize this for folks. Violet is a psychotherapist and she lives and works in Ann Arbor, Michigan. And she specializes in self-love, authenticity, and becoming spiritually awake. So right up our alley. She's currently writing a book on these topics and it's entitled A Special Kindness, the Practice of And Authenticity. So we've got lots we wanna dig into there. Thank you for being with us.

Violet: Sure. Thank you for having me.

Marty: Could I start out by, just, I also read more about you in preparation and you had written about some very extraordinary expenses that you've been through personally, and I'm, I'm assuming that they've played a role in your understanding of this thing called the true you. And it reminded me as I was reading about your, um. You think rid of cancer and you are also lost your memory that of, of an exercise I was taught a long time ago when I first learned meditation sort of an introductory exercises where with eyes closed, the teacher had us. Feel our body like, just really get into the body, be absorbed in attention on the body, and then notice what it is that's paying attention to the body. And then he had us, he let us in observing our own mind, the thoughts and the, the feelings and the memories and the anticipations the mind, and then asked us again, what is it? That's observing your thoughts. And so the, I I feel like we were re this, you got to do this in your life. Like first you had this experience of a whole new body or a tension on your body and a new relationship to your body. Then a tension on your mind and a whole new you and relationship to, and that's. Just seems to put one in a very spiritual place if you ask me. So I wondered what.

Violet: Yes. Um, I, I like the exercise you mentioned. Um, I went through, uh, uh, I was, um, uh, in a Rupert Pyra, uh, group and, uh, looking at videos, uh, of him, his teachings. And he has one very similar to what you are talking about. It adds, uh, an element though that I think is really, um. Uh, important and interesting. and it, it's, it's kind of more so it goes like this. Notice that if you are not thinking, are you still there? What we're looking for in this exercise is what's the eye, what is the eye that's looking around that's here, that's paying attention to this or that. so, so that's the eye exercise. And so if you aren't thinking, are you still there? Yeah. Okay. Uh, how do you know? I, I'm just aware that I am, you're, so you're aware that you're, uh, there and, and if you withdraw your attention from your perceptions and sensations and your thoughts, are you still there? Yeah. Well, how do you know I. I don't know. I'm just here. I just, I'm aware that I'm here so that the, it brings it down to the, so the i, the very core of oneself is awareness itself. That's a word we have for it as human beings, you know, it can't encapsulate it, but I think it's a, a, a nice word because it's, people understand what being aware is. And then, uh, he said so. And then notice some qualities about awareness. Turn your awareness on awareness itself and you know, what do you notice about it? Does it come and go? No, it's always there. I. Uh, does it fluctuate? Do you notice? Uh, no, there's no fluctuation whatsoever in it. Um, so, um, the, uh, I would call that the core eye. I would call that, you know, um, the core essence of everything or the one consciousness. Uh, and, um, so, so the way I look at a human being is in the very center, is that. So when I say I this, I that, whether I realize it or not, I'm coming from a point of consciousness, uh, and, and, and referring to things and then the way I look at it. So, and then it's in the center of a sphere of consciousness and the sphere of consciousness is our soul. And it's not just one thing, it's individuated. There's something unique in, in about every soul. so I see that soul is emanating through the body and the mind. Thus, uh, creating the experience of authentic self or the real self, or our uniqueness. So, um, so it, I, for me, I think it's very, uh, helpful to, first of all understand the point of awareness within ourselves. It's nice to withdraw into, it's very peaceful. Um. But to also recognize that we have what we might call uniqueness, and it's not just the body and in biology, there's something else there. Uh, and I like the question, do you prefer chocolate or vanilla? And people can answer that and, and say, oh, vanilla. Well, why? I don't know. I, I just do. There's something unique about our preferences, our gifts, our interests, our style, our um, so, and um, so I think that's the authentic self and it's important. We don't, in my mind, we don't wanna dissolve into nothingness, become nothing, you know, that we're here is something as an invi of this, and it's precious. If I'm here as an individuation, both spiritually and physically, see my main job is to be that and to be that as, uh, with as much integrity and care to be my authentic self is doing my job, if that's what I'm here is, so I can emphasize that.

Marty: That's very great. Uh, that. This is great summary, I think of the history of philosophy about human being. It's really well said. Um, and I just wanted to, if I could, and if you're up for it, how these experiences in your life, you know, led you to your understanding of your authenticity.

Violet: Yes. Um, uh, so, um. I, uh, read, uh, a book, uh, around, um, maybe 25, 30 years ago by Karen Horne called Neurosis and Human Growth. And in that book she talks about that there's a false self and a real self. That's the first time I'd ever heard of such a thing. And that the false self is more or less our programming. You know, the thoughts that are down, I mean, our, our belief systems, which are downloaded by our, uh, child experiences. They aren't us. They're like. Downloading programs in a computer. And if we can live inside of that and it's more living out the false self, but there's something deeper, there's something authentic that she refers to real self

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Violet: um. So I became in, I became interested. And then the, the next major piece was, uh, reading John Bradshaw's inner child books, uh, uh, uh, reclaiming your Inner child and doing inner child exercises and realizing that by accessing my inner child, I was creating a circuit down to my authentic, uh, responses. inner child is not trying to be something. It seems like it's just being what it is. It doesn't know how to be other. It's just sort of giving its real feelings and fears.

Marty: before all those downloads.

Violet: Right. That, that, that was there from the beginning. And, and I, I, so it's an access to the, the core, uh, uniqueness in our soul, so to speak. So we're gone and we pop out of our body, we're still gonna be that, you know, when people near death experiencers pop out of their body, um, some of them will say, well, I looked down on my body, I realized I must have died. And then I realized, but I'm still here. I'm still here. That same point of consciousness within an individuation, pop out and say, I popped out and I was one with everything. They pop out and say, I'm still here. So again, that individuation, uh, of, of ourselves, I just think is, is a precious thing.

Marty: That's very helpful. Yeah, well, It also gives be. It is an extraordinary experience for one thing and, and it, and the way that you talk about it, I, I like because it gives us all access to, to play with that and to, and to discover that, that authentic self inside of it. So it's

Violet: Yeah,

Marty: Thank you for the

Violet: I.

Marty: vocabulary.

Violet: So, so here I had sort of a, that idea and that thought and some practices going around that. Um, uh, and I did, uh, that I became a psychotherapist and I used inner child work a lot. So a very robust, very, uh, helpful process. and then I was diagnosed with breast cancer. And, um, uh, I was scheduled for a mastectomy. And, um, at the time I'd been meditating regularly for a while. I had some, you know, you get side effects of psychic abilities and seeing auras or you picking up energy. There's, and their byproducts. So, uh, uh, a regular meditation process at, at any rate, uh. A friend came to me, uh, before the mastectomy and said, you know, you're a spiritual person. Don't you wanna at least try some other thing or see if there's another way? And I said, well, it makes sense to me. If you've got cancer in your body, you get it out. And, uh, and, but it got me thinking. there another way? I mean, is it worth, you know, exploring? So, I, I went to a, um, intuitive, medical intuitive. She called herself and I just called and said, I, I, I'd like to make an appointment and come in. I didn't tell her what I had or anything I got there. I said, uh, well I have breast cancer. And she says, I know. Um, I've been praying about it all week. And she says, and I would love to tell everyone what I'm about to tell you, but I can't. in your case, I'm only hearing one thing complete and total healing. And she says, I don't know how it's gonna come about. You might need a little surgery or, so she's not, not sure, but, but you'll be completely happy with the results. That's what I know.

Marty: Hmm.

Violet: Um, so, um, here's where the authenticity, uh, comes in, right? Because. Um, I had a dilemma on my hands now, didn't I? Um, all the doctors get a mastectomy now, and, and then this woman, uh, saying that, that actually there's an intention, she, she consider herself, um, a medical intuitive, but she channels, uh, spirits of some kind. They guide her, so she's able to. To give you that information. So it's like listening to a channel, and this is what the being said, and, uh, searched my heart about it and decided I think that the right way to go is to at least try it. And, um, so put the mastectomy off for three months, um, and, and began seeing her where she guide me and run love through my body. Um, and, uh, uh. So I, it, it's a story that can, has a lot of details, but I'm gonna keep it succinct the context of our conversation. but at any rate, I went in for the three month checkup and, uh, the cancer had reduced 50%. Um, we weren't fighting the cancer every day. I had to hold my breast and send love to it and have four people I know send love. So it was a love-based healing. So, I mean, once there was the 50% reduction, I was on board now and we were full steam ahead and, um, at the end of a year I had my final scan and they thought their machine was broken because the was completely gone. the tissue that had been eaten up by the cancer had grown back, so you can't tell I'd ever had breast cancer. Um, and uh, and so one of the interesting things was, um, uh, so I went to her one last time after I had the final results just, and, and to have her ask the spirits why me? And, uh, the spirit said, um, well, for many reasons, which will be revealed over time. But if you wanna know what it is about you in particular that made this possible,

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Violet: it's because you trust yourself and this is what is unique about you. Okay? Um, and, and I'll, and then they said, and if you think that was a miracle, it's nothing compared to the second miracle. Okay? We'll stick with the first miracle for.

Marty: One second what I'm hearing and then I'll let you continue. Fascinating. But just to like create a c for a, for the listener. Um, it sounds to me like what you're implying, what you're saying is that this relationship to the true you has the power to heal us.

Violet: I, so I think about it this way. That rather than listening to all the doctors and research and, and people to everyone saying, you know, have a mastectomy. Oh my God, the doctors were freaking out. I won't see you again until after the mastectomy. But rather than listening to that, I listened to the guidance of my authentic self. I was able, I'd had enough practice hearing from it, so to speak, and saying, okay, it's saying go this way. So. I,

Marty: it.

Violet: I, I followed that leading through the entire process. That was my way of dealing with it. And, and apparently the fact that I, you know, was so connected to and believed in it and chose to follow that over what anybody else said, um, is what made the healing possible.

Marty: Got it. Amazing. I mean, there, I'm, I just feel like there's a, a sun in my heart burning Bright right now. Listening to you.

Violet: Wow. I love that.

Marty: So what about the second miracle then?

Violet: Yeah. So the second miracle, um, was, ended up being, I thought it was like, I'm gonna grow wings and fly around or something. Something I, wow. What is it gonna happen here? But what it ended up being was, um, I, uh, developed a seizure disorder it, I, I, uh, didn't know at the time exactly how it had damaged my brain, but I, it wiped out all of my memories, I, including working memory. So, um, uh, I was still able to speak, but I would say my language skills were around fourth or fifth grade. I mean, you couldn't tell in a way that I couldn't speak necessarily, but so I, I was, I was communicating well enough. Yeah, my memories were wiped out. and all of this started at the beginning of Covid at the same time. Okay. So, um, I lived, I lived alone and, and, and here I am, uh, wandering around my home like a zombie. But, um, I still continue to do psychotherapy over, um. You know, over telehealth, I continue to do psychotherapy. Um, I couldn't remember my clients from week to week, faces or anything about 'em, and some I'd seen for years. I, I write everything down when they're talking, and then before the session I would read the whole thing and, uh, go from there, sit in the seat and do my job. And, uh, no one ever knew that I was ill. And I have some clients I saw before, during, and after, and they, it was nothing happened. And, um, and even talk about, apparently I was doing good work. So it, it was very, very odd. And, and the other thing that was happening during that time is I, uh, had been in a Rupert SPI group. And he's, uh, uh, about spiritual awakening and becoming aware of awareness. It's, he says it a lot, being aware of awareness. Um, so, um, so that was most of my contact with the outside world. Uh, so during that time, uh, again, my ego was obliterated. Um, and I was, uh, in, in this Rupert Spire group looking at being aware of awareness. And so I, I really, I would say I had an awakening, you know, it's not like Eckhart Toley where I, you know, forever turned in, you know, went to a altered state or anything. But I became very aware that the center center of me was just pure awareness and, um, and that it became very easy for me to step back into it. Uh, and just, you know, just be watching everything happening. My body, my mind out there. I it, I'm just watching it. Um, so, um, any rate, but it also was talking about, Rupert talks about once you're awake, then the job is to your ego structure to the qualities of consciousness, which would be, you know, uh, uh. Lack of preferences, lack of resistance, um, you know, not paying too much attention to ego as if it's something to just sort of let it be a tool to be conscious in every moment and non-resistant, that sort of idea. Um, so given that, that experiencing that, it made my recovery very difficult. At some point, the seizures were under control and I began to recover. Not my memories, but working memory and then building new memories. Rebecoming a person, and as I was trying to rebe become a person, you know, I was hearing the teachings of that. It's kind of foolish. The ego's just sort of a fool that don't take too seriously. so it was very difficult, very challenging. I, I'll, I'll fast forward to the end. At some point I realized that this was causing me, um, great distress and disorientation, and that in fact I needed an ego structure to function in the world. I. And, and I wasn't gonna buy into that. It's not important anymore. So I loved the group, and, uh, Rebe began focusing on my individuality, my authentic self, and trying to reconstruct an ego structure that supported my authentic self. You know, and to do it with love, like, like an inner child thing, the inner child. So, so then it's, it's very similar to parts, isn't it? Begin to pay attention to your mind in a kind way. And together we are gonna put this thing all back together and and we did. Um, and so. I've done some research since all that, and I think what happened is my hippocampus was, um, damaged by the seizures. Now the hippocampus, so, so when my memories started coming back, not memories of the past, but. Information about the past. I could remember. Uh, what is Dorothy's from The Wizard of Oz's last name? Gail. You know, I remember I started remembering, uh, my, my language skills expanded again. I could remember some things about information, but what I noticed, and this is a couple, two, three years process of. You know, re getting enough memory to, to be seated in the world. Okay. That none of my memories about being a person ever came back. I don't remember me in those memories. I read about myself. I learned about myself secondhand by reading journals, texts, talking to people, um, and so forth. So I had to read about who I'd been. Um, and sometimes I

Bill: Can I jump in?

Violet: sure.

Bill: I, I've been sitting with this question and uh, and you're beginning to answer it, and I'm guessing that my listeners have been, some of them at least have been sitting with the same question. You told us that in great detail about what happened with the cancer, with the breast cancer. So now I think you're beginning to answer my question, which is, so you lost all your memory. How do you know you had cancer?

Violet: Yes, I read, I wrote a, I wrote a, a book, a little book about it. Um, and I read the book and it was just fascinating.

Bill: Wow. So you know that you had cancer and, and recovered from it because you'd written a book about it. Other than that, you had no memory of it.

Violet: Yes. I'm sorry. What'd you say?

Bill: Other than that, you had no memory of it.

Violet: I didn't know who

Bill: Wow.

Violet: had, what had happened, um, per se. So I had to, you know, learn from people who I'd been and, and what I was like in

Bill: Wow.

Violet: Um, and, uh. So now that, so then when the, I, I, I sometimes will get like a, I can remember my childhood home, like a photograph of it, sort of, kind of get an, i, it is like a snapshot, but it's, it's, it's two dimensional. I don't remember living in that home. I don't remember being me in that home. So nothing related to me being me and my history. Ever came back and I'm like, you know, I realize those are the memories not coming back. so I, I did some research in the hippocampus. Is what's responsible for our sense of self and our memories related to a personal, to, to personal memories and, and that connection of personal experiences and memory. so I figured out, that's why I don't have memories of that. It's, it's literally my, my memories about being that person, um, never came back. Um. Uh, I also figured out why could I do psychotherapy? What in the world that, um, if you, it is sort of like my ego structure was obliterated, right? when you do psychotherapy, even now, I like to sit more in awareness and not have, you know, not. Come from my parts or from myself to really be present and have all that on them. Apparently. Maybe I miss it even better than I'm now, but that it at least explained how in the world could have that really been been happening. I. uh, so yeah, I rebeca a person. So instead of the Rupert Spire, you know, just your, your ego is this kind of fool. Um, I, uh, rebuilt it and helped support it in a way that honored it and honored my sense of, uh, my real self, my, and so, so how does one access their authentic self, your, uh, emotions, your sensations. Your, um, in intuition, um, and your preferences and preferences are huge. Vanilla or chocolate. Okay. You know, um, and your preference is what do you want to do next? What do you want to do next? Do you wanna go to the movie tonight or don't you at least know whether you wanna, the friend says, please come. I wanna go. I haven't seen you in a while. Do we go or don't we at first at least know whether you prefer to all, you know, all things being equal. No, I don't really prefer to go. I'm tired tonight, so, so that's. um, being honest with yourself, being able to tap into your authentic self and being honest with yourself about it. I don't wanna go now. The next step to authenticity is being honest with others in the world. So it's, it's living from your authenticity. Um, uh, and, and saying, you know what, I, I'm sorry. This isn't a good night. I'm just beat, and, and I hope, you know, maybe over the weekend or let's definitely plan to go, but this isn't a good night. It's my belief that when we act from our authentic self, we're doing what's best. And I mean, in the higher sense, it's the best next step to go for ourselves in ways we couldn't even know. It is not necessarily what I want more than anything, but I can feel that that's the authentic leading that way we follow it. It's best for ourselves. People will look back and say, yeah, you know, they'll say, boy, it's a good thing we didn't go to the, the meeting actually, you know, they had a flood there. So you know, you look back and say, wow. But, but my belief is, is also that when we do what's best for ourself, we are automatically doing what's best for the whole. Uh, because we are being our part of the system in, in its most functional way, its part in the best way, which adds to the functionality and the wellbeing of the entire system.

Bill: Violet, I wanna jump in if I could. I have a, I have so many notes. About things I'm, I'm wanting, wanting to ask you about, but, but just to, to expand on what you've just now said. For years I've been thinking about how what you say is true, that from my authentic self. There seems to be what I've been calling an, an internal guidance system

Violet: Yes.

Bill: that points me exactly where I should be going. And, uh, I talked to my clients about it in this way. When I was growing up, my siblings and I played a game called Warmer, warmer, colder, colder. And the way it would work is one of us would hide an object and then we would, we would. Uh, get stationary somewhere and observe as everyone else looked for the object that we'd hidden. And we would give feedback to those that were looking. And so to my sister, Chrissy, I might say warmer, and to my sister, Cindy, I might say colder to my brother Stan. I'd say really cold. Give, giving them an indication of how close they were getting to the object. Warmer meaning meant that they were getting closer and it was, it was just a lot of fun. Well, it seems like we're playing warmer, warmer, colder, colder in life too. Like, if I can tap, tap into this internal guidance system, what, that's what I've been calling it. And you're just putting such great three, uh, dimension to it as you, you talk about it, that not only. Do I find my own purpose and, and, uh, my reason for being here, but as you say, it seems also to have far more expansive, uh, benefits as well, like everybody else around me, benefits as well. And maybe as Marty pointed out, I think you just pointed that out, Marty, that it, it would save me from, no, I guess it was you that said that, by the way, it might save me from that accident that was gonna happen if I hadn't taken that exit just now.

Violet: Right? Yes. Yes. So it it's the, it's it's guidance in terms of the greater picture. Like when you say, um, like. I wanted to be a psychotherapist, or at least just stumbling upon it and, and,

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: that that's what I want it to be. And,

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: becoming a passion, not just a profession, uh, I think I, I, I am able to give the best of me to the world that. So in the greater picture, uh, where I wanna live, what, you know, the, the greater things, but then also on the micro level, what is the next thing to do right now? Keep talking or be quiet,

Bill: Mm-hmm. Mm-hmm.

Violet: So every moment there's that guidance system and, uh, you know, awareness helps even more to, to really be aware of that, be conscious of, uh, of being conscious of your authentic self and pull back and be able to watch and say, oh yeah, there's the leading, there's the leading moment to moment as well as the big picture.

Bill: Uh, if I could, I'd like to, um, begin to bring more into the conversation. Um. The language that, that, those that are listening, because they are oriented to the internal family systems model, uh, if we could help them out a little bit and, and, and, and so to do so, I have a couple of questions for you leading into that, and then I've got some deeper questions if that's okay. Marty, I wanna, I wanna make sure that I leave space and room for you as well, if there's something that you wanna make sure that you ask or comment about.

Marty: Hey, what's best for you is best for all of us.

Bill: Okay. First of all, I'd be interested in hear, hearing you define the word spirituality.

Violet: So, um, as, as I spoke, I think so I think of it because, so I'm a body right now. And inside or running through my body is my soul, and that's where my preferences are coming from. It's the information about my individuality. And inside that soul is pure consciousness, the ability to be aware of everything. So that's how I see it. So, you know, when they say we're spiritual beings, having a human experience, that that resonates with me. That seems to be, uh, what's going on here. Um, and so, um, being a spiritual person then. I, I, I think I would, I would sum it, sum it up this way that the answers are within me. They're not

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: That's

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: more of a religious orientation. Here's the rules, here's the doctrines, here's the practices where spirituality is every, all the guidance is inside.

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: look for the answers there, and that they're there to be found. The kingdom of heaven is within you, within you and nowhere else. That kind of idea. So it's a, it's, you know, I think psychotherapy is a kind of spirituality because you're, you're, you're looking and you're being introspective. You're seeing what's in there, what's going

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: and

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: to do it, uh, hopefully in a compassionate way, uh,

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: And then you, you know, you pay more, you. More attention to your sensations, to your, your breath, your body, your, um, intuition. Uh, and then, uh, come to value our, your authentic self. You know, the truth. What do I really think about that? What do I really wanna do? You know, what do I really wanna say? What do I feel like I should say in this conversation? Um, uh, and, and going, it's an inside out job. And following that.

Bill: Okay, good. So, uh, you said your ego was obliterated. Uh, that's something that you wrote when I sent you the questionnaire and asked you to help us get ready to have this conversation. So, when your ego was obliterated, what was obliterated?

Violet: So everything was obliterated. All of my memories, even working memory. Where'd I put my tea? What did, uh, you know, did I eat today? Do I, I mean literally. So everything for a while was obliterated before the seizures were under control. Um, and then as I got on the medicine and, and my brain started to recover, I re I began to recover. Not a whole lot of 'em, honestly, but some memories of the past as snapshots kind of a thing. Um, but you know, memories, you know, they involve us. You remember being there and how you felt. Did you like that steak? It was a good meal. It was fun, it was a groovy environment and that every you, you remember being inside of that memory and having that, uh, you know, 3D experience. So, um, since that was gone. Um, as things started to come back, I had to, um, reground myself in what are my preferences, you know, what kind of ego structure do I want? Do I wanna be funny when I interact with people? If so, what sense of humor do I want to have? uh, you know. Uh, what, who, who to interact with, where to put my energy. How do I know if it's a good connection? If not, um, much time do I spend playing the guitar? How much time do I spend with this or that? Um, how do I want to do my hair a dress? Um, I had to rediscover my preferences that way. And then. Uh, and then know that as I'm knowing that now my ego is, is getting a download from my experiences as I, as I explore myself um,

Bill: Now based on, I'm, I'm sorry to interrupt, but, but I wanna make, I wanna make this connection. Uh, by the way, I, I want you to know that I'm coming from real interest here. I'm really curious and interested in learning from you, and I feel it feels like that I am, like you're filling in some, filling in some gaps for me that I, that I've been trying to fill in, in this very conversation. So I heard from you that the soul, you see, you have this body and the, the soul is within this body and within the soul is pure consciousness. And that's who you are.

Violet: Yes.

Bill: That's so I have, I have this body and inside the the, and in inside. It's not, it I, I'm sure you don't mean physically inside the body is a soul or do you mean that

Violet: you know, when the near death experiences say I popped outta my body, there's a sense that it's inside. But I think the soul is much larger than even this

Bill: Yeah.

Violet: So it, I think it's coming through like a light coming through a prison, coming through

Bill: yes,

Violet: That part

Bill: yes.

Violet: of it and it's all, so yeah, I kind of see it

Bill: And you said that this, you said that the soul is what, um, maybe establishes my uniqueness, my pre my preferences. So when you say you, your ego was obliterated, as you're describing it, you're describing a disconnection from your soul. Am I right? Mm-hmm.

Violet: And my, um, configuration of belief structures or parts that, that, that thought and belief structure gives me a sense of my thoughts being different from your thoughts. Me being, I like this, you like that, you know, I'm feeling this, you feeling that? So it, that's, it's, it's function and it's mechanism. Who am I as a person? And usually that's downloaded in our childhood because it's, it's just

Bill: So that's the ego.

Violet: Yeah, we, we come to learn that, okay, you know, I'm a kid and you know, this is the right way to do it. Do your homework, brush your teeth. Um, you know, don't, don't, uh, speak at the table. What, whatever we learn or, you know, um, we learn about our culture. We learn about what's expected. We learn maybe in religion what's. Good and what's evil and what's happening, uh, in this lifetime and what it all means and how the, how to be a good person relating to it or how to rebel and you know, where to find people who are rebel. I, so, so we get a sense, but, but it's downloads from, uh, the beliefs we, we get from our family of origin, from our culture, and then our experiences. You know, if

Bill: Okay.

Violet: bit by a dog, maybe you learn, don't get so close to that type of dog again. And so we're

Bill: Please help me to understand,

Violet: all these programs about who you are and how to be in the world and how to interact is what I see as the ego structure.

Bill: okay. Now distinguish for me now the preferences of the soul. How, how are, how can you distinguish that?

Violet: So, um, um. S so, and I will say period. So let's, let's go back to the example about your friend wants you to come with him to the movies tonight.

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: really looking forward to it, and you realize as we get closer that you just, you're tired and you just, it isn't, isn't feeling like you wanna go. And so that all things being equal, you wouldn't prefer to go. I don't prefer to go. Um, it's not like every time you're tired, you don't prefer to go. Sometimes we can be tired and prefer to go, so it isn't exact, but we, so preference are preferences are the North star. They're what telling us in a sense what our unique, authentic configuration, you could say our sole guidance. That's what we're

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: now. Thoughts might be, oh, you know, um, uh, we haven't seen each other for a while. I know she's really looking forward to it. And, you know, how many times can you cancel on a friend? I canceled on her before. Okay. Um, or, or maybe saying, well, I, I don't wanna go, but I know when I say I'm not going to, she's gonna gimme a hard time. So all of that, you know, I know my preferences. Now the mind comes in. uh, and, and starts to give Its 2 cents it.

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: we decide. So do you follow what the ego or the parts of ego may a part is gonna say,

Bill: There.

Violet: what, if you

Bill: Yeah.

Violet: go, don't go. And I'm with you. I'm in it. She gives us a hard time. I got your back right. And, and other parts that are freaking out and saying, you know, gosh, I maybe I am really a selfish

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: Maybe I really

Bill: Mm-hmm.

Violet: I am. And gosh, know, I don't like being selfish. It doesn't, and I don't like people getting mad at me. So we have all these facets of the ego structure, the belief structures, I. That are coming into play. And so, um, the more aware we are, the more we can step back into pure consciousness. We can notice that part and that part and that part without getting caught up. Part of me wants to do that. Part of me wants, but those are the ego structure, but authentically what I really wanna do. All things being equal magic wand, I can do whatever I want. This is what I wanna do. So, so that's how you distinguish between it.

Bill: Got it. That's so helpful. I heard you say parts or facets of the ego structure. Would you agree? Did I, did I hear it right?

Violet: Yes. The what, what, what Richard Schwartz figured out. Is that the ego structure is not one thing and ego structure, that it's a system of parts that, that kind of have their own, their own belief structures, their own, um, struggles. Um, and, and like the many personalities, uh, that are just part of the greater system of personality and, uh, you know, um, that, uh, it's not just a, a. One way to look at it, I think, you know, that we all have, who have, used it. That is how the ego structure works, and we can access these different parts and help them, help, help them to, to, um, you know, become relaxed and, and, you know, um, less confused and cooperate with each other.

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Bill: So one more step, one more question and then I'm gonna hand it back to Marty. We've got about 10 minutes left here before we need to wrap.

Violet: Okay.

Bill: Uh, so the next step is we've talked about parts, we've talked about ego, we've talked about spirituality and soul. Gosh, I'm loving this. Where does self come into all this? What is self.

Violet: this is where my take on it is different than pure IFS. So kind of controversial. So now we don't listen to me as any kind of IFS expert. Now here I am with my own sense of it. I notice within my personality structure, there is a part that I've called the supportive self. And what it does, it, it, um, it doesn't have an agenda for itself. It's like, it's just pure, uh, so, so I'll do it this way. So let's say I'm, I'm struggling with something and if I ask the supportive self to step forward immediately, it's like, you know. You know, here I am, sweetheart. I know you're struggling. I'm, I'm with you in this, you know, so what do you wanna do with this? Maybe we should just sit down and take a breath for a moment, or how does this sound? You want a cup of tea? Um, so it's, it's a hundred percent in support of my being. It's kind, it's compassionate. That is, now we're getting into the cs. It, it has those qualities, but it is a part of my personality. that, that it, it, it's, it like other parts, it steps forward and backward. But when I ask it to step forward, it's immediately there. It has no preferences of its own except to love and support and help me. So I think that's what IFS calls the capital as self and that, um. My sense is how I developed this part or else redeveloped a part into it through inner child work. It's like I created a circuit down to my authentic self. Um. In a loving way. I love my inner child, you know, how can I help? And, you know, I understand and mirroring and, you know, um, I, I, you know, and being kind and developing a relationship with it, like a parent is just there to support and affirm and help. And that, that part that I learned to talk to my inner child with, develop this part of my brain that is the supportive self. And, you know, it doesn't talk to me like an inner child. So much anymore, but just a loving, you know, supportive aspect to my being. So, so that is, to me, the capitalist self that IFS speaks about. The capital S self that I might say is the I, pure consciousness is I, and I can step all the way back in it. This is the awakening I had from spi. A I can step all the way back until I'm just a presence with no preference and no, it's just there. Watching it all. then, uh, so there's that pure consciousness thing, and it, it, it, I wouldn't say it's kind compassionate and encouraged. It doesn't have any personality, but it's quality is, is open. There's, we might say it, it doesn't come and go. It doesn't have judgment. It, it doesn't shift is it has a benign constancy and it's just observing. So, so again, it. It's not unsupportive in any way and it's interested ' cause it's always there watching, it doesn't have a personality like kind, compassionate, the seas of it that I would say my supportive self has. So I now see. That my supportive self, it, it really connects to pure consciousness and channels it through the personality so that it does have a personality to it. Um, uh, and that's how I see it.

Bill: Wow. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you, Marty. I'm gonna hand it back to you. Wow, violet. Thank you.

Marty: Well, I wanna, if you don't mind the ask a more mundane kind of question, but one that might be, um, useful to the listeners. Not that what you just said wasn't, it was enormously useful, but, um, um, um, I wanna ask about your, process, your methodology, working with people because they haven't been through these extraordinary, miraculous

Violet: Right.

Marty: and yet you wanna guide them to understand their, their self and their awareness and their parts and

Violet: Yes. Yes.

Marty: So what, how, what does the session look like? How do you do that? How do you get people to understand what you understand having been through these experiences and they haven't?

Violet: Yeah, so I think it's very similar to probably what most IFS practitioners do, and I haven't taken any of the courses. Um, uh, uh, so I'm familiar with the process though. Um, so it's this, so I start, um, um, just like, do you ever notice part of you wants to, part of you doesn't. know that that's how our mind is. lit, they're literally a system of parks, and that if we interact with them in a kind, compassionate way and hear from them, it can help us to become a. Uh, more kind and loving and, and, and, and a lot of traumas and distress that, that these parts can, can hold onto, can be healed. And so we can access and we can help these parts and we can understand, uh, our, our ego structure much better when we look at it that way.

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Violet: where I might, uh, well, where I add in the. The consciousness aspect. Uh, I, I don't tend to, unless they really come at me wanting to know more about awareness and consciousness and being awake. But if they don't, we're just doing psychotherapy. I, I talk about do you notice that? You know, but you are conscious of it. We can become conscious. A part of me does this, a part of me does this. I prefer this as a human being. I'm experiencing this. Um. Uh, a part of me says, is a part of me says this, but I prefer that direction. So I kind of just work in that way that the more conscious we become and can step back from our personality and, and parts and see it, the more agency we can have. You know, we can notice this part is distressed and we can give it our kind attention.

Marty: Mm-hmm. you. Thank you very much. It's great talking to you. I, I think that Bill and I have a lot to talk about that difference between, um. Pure awareness self and the self that I have had. Bill and I have been trying to talk about that for a long time, and I think that you summarized it in a way that he and I are now gonna be able to discuss that in, in, in a way we haven't up to this point.

Bill: I think so too. I think that was very, very, very helpful. I've had a sense that Marty, what you've had had to say about that is of great value and yet you've sensed it. There's been a disconnect for me and I think Violet just really helped along those lines and maybe it's been helpful for, I, I'm sure that, so for many of our listeners, it's probably also been helpful, especially those of us in the IFS model that I, I personally have felt like there's something a little bit off. I. About the explanation of self as a separate entity or energy within the system that's separate from parts. And that is, um, way too much in my opinion, uh, like the deities represented in religion that are separate from us that we have to somehow fight and climb and try and work for. Uh, it, it doesn't, that doesn't feel right to me. And the way that you just explained it, violet. When I said, wow. Wow. Well, thank you. Was so validating. So validating and, and filled in a lot of gaps for me.

Violet: Okay, good And my heart is, is so full. I mean, what I, what gives me the most pleasure in, in life is to be helpful to people and for someone to say that's helpful and that helped me put some things together and thank you. And so, you know, I just, you know, glowing with, with, with joy that, that, you know, it's, it's been helpful.

Marty: Very much so. Thank you for

Bill: Let, let's, let's go back Before we say goodbye completely. I wanna talk a little bit more about this book, how far along the name of the book, a Special Kindness, the, the Practice of Self-Love and, and Authenticity. How far, far along are you in the book?

Violet: So it's one of those things where it's almost like I've written a bunch of little essays.

Marty: Mm-hmm.

Violet: I understand the umbrella that I'm trying to do and how I would add my, uh, the breast cancer story, the inner child work stuff, and, and the obliteration of my ego, uh, my personal spiritual awakening without. Maybe too much emphasis on it, but that, that I, I, my message what I have to say is what we've talked about today. So that's my message, how it's all gonna come in the book. I've had, I had a seer actually a meeting saying, don't rush the book. Take your time. And I see now as I recover and I more and more conceptualize what's happened to me and all. Now I understand the hippocampus. So she wants me to take my time, so I'm taking my time. So, it's like the, there's all these little parts of the book are, are floating around and, and I'm getting to point where I'm about to start, uh, really putting them in a certain form.

Bill: I wanna pitch my. Writing coach Jerry Waxler, who's going to be a guest on the podcast, and he's helping me to write my memoir. Without him, I don't know that I would've been able to sew my story together as well as it has been.

Violet: Is that W-A-X-L-E-R.

Bill: Yep. And if you'd like, I'll just connect the two of you off stage here.

Violet: I'd love that.

Bill: Okay. Well, wow, what a, what an honor, and what a pleasure to have you on the show. Thanks so much for joining us.

Violet: Thank you. Thank you. It's been a delight.